Willard:
> "The "bandwidth of RL" that I'm talking about is the combined
> rate that information reaches the Mind from RL through the senses."

>> but then wouldn't that be the bandwidth of the senses?

Yup. Would be, 'cept I'm a bull-headed, stubborn, illiterate, untraveled,
uncultured, ethnocentric, intolerant, ill-mannered bastard of a walkin'
talkin' stereotypical American, and I make it a point to be confusing as
possible when talking about Real Life. So, I'm stickin' to mah guns, and to
mah ill-chosen wording, like it or lump it.

Besides, y'all sayin' that _mah_ senses ain't _Real-Life_?
Them's killin' words back where mah pappy's from...
@LERI= Murali Monkey (what is leri?)

Let's not talk about our machine's power,
let's talk about our machine's soul !
@FC= Nick McDowell (Re: MacWarezzzz....)

[..] you can program your computer to be exactly the type of relationship
that you want. It's kind of difficult to get your SO to behave that way.
@FC= Nick (Re: Trying to make my WOPR jr.)

i NEVER watch tv any more; i can't interact with it.
@FC= "free agent .rez" (one difference)

CountZer0 says:
> Hey, just this weekend I saw a story on CNN the show was FutureWatch It
> was about addiction... However, i don't know if it is addiction...
yes it is

> I mean, I've been interviewing folx for voices, and i get some
> who say that the net is an extension, or part of normal reality.
yes it is

> Well if it's just another integrated part of life than it really doesn't
> qualify as an addiction, or does it...
yes it does

> A drug user would say the same thing...
yes they would

> But then, if it is, isn't everything we do an addiction?
yes.

> confusion reigns supreme...
yes.
@FC= andy hawks (Re: me and my moo, moo)

y'know, this didn't mean much to me until i thought about it. Recent
snippets of my rl conversations:

 "You can grep some good stuff from _Stranger in a Strange Land_"

 "B T W (spelled out)- <insert afterthought here>"

 "Your RAM is fracked."
   or, even better:
 "shit! she really had some zero's sprayed through ram, didn't she?"

i dunno if this means anything to anyone, but thassok.
that and net.sex. i think that that is a serious alteration of culture.
(i know *i'm* not that loose in rl.)
@FC= T'han the Unbeliever (Re: National Character of Virtual Spaces)

argh, so many thoughts, so little brain cells.
@FC= freeside (Re: More MOO)

I used to MUD. Not just mud, but MUD.
I MUDded all day, and I MUDded all night.
@FC= freeside (Re: More MOO)

Also, obviously BBS's are not as large as the Internet, etc... but I don't
believe that size has anything to do with the creation of a virtual space. A
BBS and MediaMOO are both located in the same place. on a computer in a room
somewhere.
@FC= CountZer0 (Final thoughts)

See you in cyberland...
@FC= CountZer0 (thanx...)

t'han:
>   artificial reality: a construct that exists in at least 3 dimentions.
>   gui: a construct that exists in two dimentions.
>   cli: a construct that exists in one dimention.
 imho, there's a certain fractal nature to interface designs that makes this
moot. look: a GUI, even a simple HyperCard schtick, is whipped up in a nice
flat screen-sized plane. i'm sure you've seen applications in which if you
keep sliding the simple little picture to the left, eventually yo get back
around to where you started; likewise with the right. isn't this, for all
intents and purposes, 3d? it's a loop, and loops don't exist in 2d. or, if
you prefer, one could unpeel layer after layer of flat and branching
screens. layer after layer after layer. in fact, there could be so many
layers, and loops, and links, that the thing is much more like an onion than
a piece of flat paper or a screen.

 i don't even thing spacial dimensions are useful models for virtuality at
ALL. they all seem to be varying dimensions of connectivity. real REAL 3d?
bah. imho creative use of this "onion-skinning" or "looping" gui is far more
useful than some damn simulation of a 3d experience will ever be. give me
direct neural interfaces and i will readily admit to being in error. until
then...
@FC= "free agent .rez" (unwelcomed interjection)

"artificial reality." hm. hm... artificial = created, fabricated...
reality = ... urg. i don't know, really, how i'd define that.
@FC= "free agent .rez" (Re: an unwelcomed interjection)

the iNet is free! the wires may cost. the routers may cost. the computers
and maintenance may cost. but the idea, that we can all interconnect,
communicate, cooperate, *synergize*-- contrary to what governments and
corporations may tell you, that idea is FREE.

help the idea reproduce. become a NetWeaver.
@FC= adam fast (Re: the Guild: problems)

A local newspaper recently reported that a "gene complex for homosexuality
has been found at the tip of the X chromosome", for something like that, and
that a prenatal test may be possible. So it is possible that this may
present a sort of problem in the future. Namely, suppose a person or couple
is anti-abortion, and also anti-homosexual... So do they abort and save the
world from yet another homosexual, or not abort and afflict the world with
said homosexual? Or do they allow the suspect person to grow up, wait for
the behavior to appear, then kill the emerging deviant part?
@FC= rgardner (The Gene Revolution)

when human genes are mapped and the "nature" side of the nature/nurture
debate is fully understood, the prospects of "rolling your own baby" become
a lot more concrete than you'd expected. when ethnic cleansing and
superman-building become the norm, how will human society be transformed?
the human genome project may be the most sinister thing to happen to the
human race since the third reich.
@FC= freeside (Re: The Gene Revolution)

Seems my mailbox exploded to 253% of my allotted space!  ;)  oops!
@FC= Kevin Roberts (I'm Baaaack!)

It never occurred to me that a replica of gerold is scientifically
impossible [..]. *If* you could duplicate gerold, it would not be a
representation of gerold, it would be another gerold. A representation of
gerold must have gerold-like qualities, but it will not be gerold. Its
ability to represent gerold depends on it *not* being gerold, i.e., on its
'falseness' in relation to gerold. Nothing 1984ish here. Its a condition of
all representation that its truth content is premised on its falsification
content. There are accurate falsifications and innacurate ones - and social,
cultural, institutionally defined rules for telling the difference. A 1984
scenario is where there is only *one* institutional authority permitted to
distinquish false falsifications from true falsifications.
@LERI= Willard (RE: gerold and willard on realism)

[..] one (say, me for example) could construct a "signifier" that is
meaningless - the word ketchstrumph, for example. It's a lingual NULL
pointer. It must point to _something_, but there's nothing there...
waitaminit, I just lost myself...
@LERI= Murali (signifiers, signified)

is it possible to OD on excitement alone?

eesh.. i think i'm headed there. my head's gonna explode soon.
i've had no caffeine, ephedrine, amphetamine or any other speed
drug, but i'm more wired than i've been in months. all natural.

dang. can i patent this?
@LERI= Weird Mother (possibilities)

we don't produce langauge. Language produces us.
@LERI= Willard (Re: where ken and i difer ;))

Out of my window, the old lady with a wheeled tartan shopping trolley who
never walks on the pavement continues her heroic voyage back from the shops,
squarely facing the oncoming traffic, features set in a robust 'fuck you,
fourwheels', walking the double yellow line; triumphant pedestrian in a one
woman war against the wheely demon that devours ancient garbage and excretes
foul toxins to poison our long-suffering motherglobe, to besmear her loving
ways with the clinging muck of selfish ages, until she can love no more and
lies like an oildrenched seabird on an oilswept beach lapped by the sickly
ripples of a crude, oilsick sea; a wing flapping useless under sulphurous
ultra-violet skies, waving a final goodbye to the children she loved so much
that she allowed them to imprison, torture, rape and kill her.

And our seabird takes a last petroleum gasp and is dead. At this moment,
seas rise up to flood the land, storms rage out of season, forest becomes
desert and the sun chars and scorches what it once gently warmed. Hordes of
insects thrive on the decaying remains of humanity's brief spree.

It could have been so right, but it isn't.
@LERI= Al. (high octane ecorant)

[..] the old FC was a groping beginning. The new FC is a chrysalis.
@FC= Arthur Chandler (The InfiNET and good ol' FC)

"It's going backwards...
It's getting reactionary..
There's something vaguely pathetic about FC discussing MOO's..
It's not the edge anymore.."

If people thought these things abut fc an just unsubbed rather than doing
something about it, then they're just lazy fucks who think this is a Tv
channel or something. Tell them to go fuck themselves. Fc is what people
post on it. If you don't like the threads, make some new ones. End of
story. While people keep thinking like consumers they will not contribute
much to the net nor get much out of it.

Willard the Evil Bastard (in an Evil Mood)
@FC= Willard (Re: Fc good?)

As to the MOO speak... MOO's are not the issue, as someone said. When i was
at cybercon, i couldn't understand why there was so much concentration on
muds/moos. It finally dawned on me that their form is the primitive basis of
the metaverse. Like it or not, no alternative interfaces have been
developed, so it looks like the MOO form is the future, albeit with sight
and sound (see Pavel Curtis' writings). If anyone has any alternate ideas
for how the metaverse could be structured please share them... otherwise get
to know the moo, as it is shall be the foundation upon which all of
cyberspace shall develop henceforth.
@FC= jjr (:swallows the pill)

INFOGUILT has been rather seriously interpreted by several people in various
ways now, all of them quite fascinating... ogawds we're looking at a hyper-
spatial-polyglot-super-supra-subconscious-racial-field effect!
@FC= Tod Foley (Re: InfoGuilt)

global netrip 7.10.93
@FC= "free agent .rez" (nt 9t3)

Should we be afraid of sound and graphics in the cyberspace ? Will those two
elements turn our child (the Net) into a boring and passive entertainment
tube that just kill our brain cells?
@FC= Juhani Luhtanen (Re: MOOs, Integrators, and Homes for FC)

There's an interesting pattern that is developing with all this talk of
MOOS, INTEGRATORS, GOPHERS, FTP, LISTS, and what have you.

Its not so much a question of access to information or even too much
information, but a referenceing and crossreferencing of this information. It
seems similar to the problem of AI. You can increase to number of CPU's, but
the doesn't necessaryily make a smarter computer. It's the ability for the
these CPU's to talk to each other that really matters.

The neurons in the brain are quite well connected.

Are we attempting to build the FC brain?
@FC= Michael Maier (Well Connected)

Um... am I just a totally uncultured and uneducated hick? I have never heard
of this Baudrillard person. Can someone submit a SUCCINT paragraph
explaining in nontechnical and non-"academic" terms exactly who he was and
why he is suddenly so significant now?

PS- Anyone that responds with "He's the guy that created Baud" is gonna
find X-windows in their mailbox. :)
@FC= Aaron Dickey (Re: Back to Reality...)

Donald the Secretary! :
>I'd like to see if anyone has comments on the trend of Needing To Be In
>Touch (TM)... I recently introduced my boss to e-mail and now he uses it
>almost exclusively to correspond with his colleagues. It's kind of scary
>though. The first thing he does when he enters the office, he heads
>straight for his terminal. He invariably checks it three or four times a
>day and calls in at night from his house to check it again.

I think we could chalk this up to new toy syndrome. I think once you've had
e-mail you do check it a lot, but it more or else sews itself into the
fabric of your day and becomes less of an obsession. The cool thing is
e-mail is to the 21st century what letter writing was say in the 19th
century. Its as fast as a phone but its written.

>Have you ever noticed this in yourself?

Yes... I just got a computer for home. I'm having it installed in bed with me.
@FC= Michael Maier (To BE in Touch)

[...]. i spent a week at stef's without ANY net access whatsoever,
and let me just say that it was one of the best weeks of my life.
away from the net, my head cleared, i regained a sense of time,
of continuity, and i actually gave my brain a rest; i read
real books for sustained lengths of time. The net
is just too much information all at once, and
you're forced to grep it so much so fast
that you just can't comprehend it
all, you don't give yourself
the time to grok it,
and the net just
becomes tv,
and tv
sucks.
@FC= freeside (Re: new topic!?)

> though, really, the question is useless and insignificant anyway.
> the point was, media hype and corporate involvement would only hamper the
> goals of this list. period.

i don't undeerstand this corporate involvement thing. has patrick
been *directly* approached by Sony or something?

....The Panasonic FutureCulture.....

Brought to you by...
        Panasonic - we're still around.....
        Nike - Just do it..... tomorrow...
        Pepsi - The New-est generation....
and by..Apple - the power to beat your chest....

this would never happen, and even if it landed here from another dimension
and actually *did*, in my humblest of
ever-so-humble-there's-no-place-like-email opinions, the overriding nature
of the internet (subjectivist individual environments and "e-grass roots"
nature of it all) would override any *dictatorial* force.
@FC= andy hawks (Re: net luminaries)

as far as media hype goes - it gets hyped because it gets hyped... i don't
do, nor have i ever done, much hyping at all, outside of giving info about
it in teh futureculture faq, fcbot files, and a usenet crontab post on
alt.cyberpunk...

any and all other hype is not of my doing, it's out of my hands, and in my
not so incredibly humble opinion, it has been fair, bare-bones, and that's
perfectly fine by me. i'm talking about Utne, Billy Idol, Bruce Sterling's
disk, uhh, whatever else... i was never approached by any of these people,
and if anyone else was, i'd like to know about it, but, i mean, hey, it's
cool they didn't approach me, because that's the nature of information on
the net. the password is: free.
@FC= andy hawks (Re: net luminaries)

reality ping yourselves every so often, that's all i ask.
@FC= andy hawks (Re: net luminaries)

and so here's the scenario: tomorrow, Bigshot Time-Reporter signs on the
list, says he wants to do a thing on FC. So he does, it's frontpage, 5000
people on the list, publicity-waves ripple to other circles. Futureculture
goes on being futureculture, we talk about the same shit, just more people.
Mindy/meng/patrick get paid mucho $$$$ to go hang around certain companies
vr-demonstrations at cybercons and such, say the company name once in
awhile... then it all dies.

does the list still go on after the 5000 people have left? it better fuckin
be goin on, because that's the whole point...
@FC= andy hawks (Re: net luminaries)

i dig my parents. i trust people over 30. i *like* elevator music. i can see
myself owning a Lexus and living in the suburbs with a wife devoted to
herself, her family, and her career, and two kids, two years apart. and
throw in church on sundays once a month. (i have this insatiable [sp] urge
to own every Donald Fagen / Steely Dan album ever made, this summer.)

jeez, you know, you all are jsut going to have to disown me, i'm not "doin'
the chrome thing" as it were.

... and. i am still me. i am still the same old me.

that's all this comes down to, as void put it, it wouldn't change
anything...

it's just kind of antagonizing, for me at least, to come back to reading
email and usenet and find myself once again deluged in this undertow of
words that are subtly saying "i just want to rebel, is that so wrong"... i
mean the most ironic thing to me is that there's like this unwritten code of
ethics "rule #1 to being a cyber-rad person: be yourself, be an invidual, do
what you want." and people follow that rule, how individualistic of them,
=). rule #2 of course is "conform to our aesthetic".

@FC= andy hawks (Re: net luminaries)

my last email was from my dad... i love that... rad....
@FC= andy hawks (Re: net luminaries)

In cyberspace, you're only as good as your last meme.
@FC= Willard (Re: wowee whee!)

seems to me that alt.cp-esque "cyberpunks" such as St. Vitus are interested
in *personal power*, after the net has empowered them sufficiently to rule
by threat of destruction: "he who has the power to destroy a thing, controls
it" -Muad'dib, _Dune_.

we futureculture people are less interested in arming ourselves with tech;
we're more interested in the subtler ways in which these new media and
technologies affect the bedrock of civilization.
@FC= freeside (FutureCulture vs. Cyberpunk)

whadda we want?

BANDWIDTH!!!

when da we wannit?

NOW!!!!!!!!!!
@FC= Willard (Re: net luminaries)

Corporate "life" has produced some wonderful things. Corporate "life" has
produced some terrible things. Is it not possible to enjoy a product, but
not trust a company simutaneously? Or rather, enjoy many products, and not
trust many corporations simultaneously? It think it is... and I think many
people do this. I, in fact, grew up in this. Grew up in the corporatate lap
of one of the world's major chemical companies. Father worked for them. (He
left that job, and now works for a different one... same song, different
hat, as it were.) The money that raised me, that housed me, that fed me,
came from the same source that made the local river unsafe to fish in (But
we got the biggest Walleye in the damn STATE in that river, I'll have you
know... heh... sorry.) And yet, I know my father, I know him inside and out.
I respect and trust the man - possibly more than any other person I have
ever met, and for the strength of his character, not because of the blood
ties. But... do I trust the company? Well, I am in the position to see their
side of many stories... but no, I do not trust them. They fed me, and I do
not trust them. They housed me, and I do not trust them. Nor, from what I
have learned along the way, do I trust in the wisdom or judgement of many of
their "opponents".
@FC= happy zamboni (Individualism, and corporate anxiety)

Context. Context is _Very_ important.
@FC= happy zamboni (Individualism, and corporate anxiety)

You know, I'm not entirely certain WHAT is going on here, but I do know that
the vibes are getting bad, the discussions are reaching a level of pomposity
somewhat above what would be found at a convention of Ivy-Leage PhD FOBs,
and all in all I've become totally lost. Just what is going on, and is it
ever going to stop? If I want to participate in a totally incomprehensible
mailing list, I'll move to Aleph.
@FC= Aaron Dickey (Que?)

>freeside [i think; right?]
>That's one example, I don't know ANYBODY who qualifies as "top people of
>well or mindvox" who's any better about it. People either take 4 weeks to
>reply, or they never do it at all.

then
FORGET
them.

we are not there. they are not here. celebrities are already virtual enough
as fodder for the masses; i for one certainly don't need any more virtual
entities to fill out my imagination. i care about you. i don't care about
kroupa, and can't for the simple fucking reason that i've never met him,
even virtually.

i didn't come down here [wherever "here" is] hunting for celebrities, i came
here because i sought community of a sort. celebrity lust can be satiated by
television. i really hate to say this, but we may not be as Important to
Them as we are to ourselves -- or, dare i say it, as they are to us? does
that make us [as a community] any less Important? not in my book.
@FC= "free agent .rez"

Solitude is a medicine, society is food.
@FC= Arthur Chandler (Re: new topic!?)

Nobody "does" heroin. Only the first time. After that, heroin "does you".
@LERI= Zeek (Interzone (more))

I saw a cow jump over the moon tonight. Talk about some freaky shit, huh.
@LERI= Scotto

A human has to create a lot of shit to produce one work of beauty.
@LERI= Gerold Firl (dissipative structures)

[...] But really, it is pretty annoying to be told that you are *normal*. I
mean, really.
@LERI= Gerold Firl (Re: subjectivity of objectivity)

I have noticed a pleasant scent that lingers on certain tapes. Remember when
those clear tapes came out? It was that all store-bought tapes were white...
then they started making them clear. Shit! Those fuckers smelled so good I
ate one. I think it was Prince's Purple Rain.
@LERI= Zeek (Re: fancy audio)

Surely, the most interesting people are those that show signs of mild
schizophrenia but are able to purvey their thoughts and ideas coherently.
@LERI= Zeek (Re: Interzone (more))

*> This is a very useful tip, rez. I'm storing this message and printing it
*> out.

Right. I saved the original message .rez wrote, dowloaded it upon a floppy
(3m 3.5 dd) then took it to the copy shop to have it printed out on a laser
printer. It was a gorgeous 10 point Helvetica that I chose as a font. Plain?
sure... but nonetheless readable.

I have the document/letter and I'm now shopping for a frame.
@LERI= Zeek (Re: fancy audio.)

Murali axiomates:
>Until it happens to me, it doesn't exist, for me.

yup, that's my philosophy; no imperative to collapse into a yes/no state on
something like this (or anything else, for that matter). ufos, clairvoyance,
spirit guides, channeling, astral projection: who knows?
just say mu.
@LERI= andy/ajk (re: this is not about ufos)

Somewhere, there is a monkey, pounding
on a keyboard, with *your* name on it.
@LERI= Gerold Firl (Re: this is not about ufos)

if virtuality is a lego closet, i would rather
go to the factory and design my own pieces.
@FC= andy (Re: An architect's view of FC at MediamOO (fwd))

Computers are only as creative as their users, and calling my baby
uncreative is calling ME uncreative.
@FC= Ronnie Sturm ][ (MediaMOO stuff)

The greater joy (and hassle) lies in the creation, not the consumption.
@FC= Arthur Chandler (Re: "text-based vr" thoughts)

And who knows? It might be virtual pizza today, but a stunning
implementation of The Metaverse tomorrow.
@FC= Arthur Chandler (Re: "text-based vr" thoughts)

[...] I didn't miss the LA riots or the Iraqi bombing of Israel. The first I
heard the first night, at 0400 local time, on #riot in IRC. Direct reports
from people actually in houses on fire within LA. Talk about news reporters.

The Iraqi bombings of Israel was relayed to me in a similar way -- a guy in
.il was the same channel I was on when suddenly he wrote "brb (air raid
alarm)". Heh. Then he showed up a couple of minutes later saying: "Re! Here
I am in from of my shelter terminal...". I loved it...

Isn't the net wonderful?
@FC= miekael (Infinite Media)

Oh yeah, I had this other dream last night that I was driving Home from
Buffalo, and somehow I wound up driving through Hell. Kinda cool, actually -
I really like big fires with lots of smoke and stuff, and there was burning
shit all over on either side of the road, and I couldn't see very far, but
it didn't smell or anything. Weird people down there, too. Oh yeah, and I
learned one thing pretty quick - the U.S. and Canada _are_ the ones who've
got it wrong - they drive on the left side of the road _everywhere_ else,
even in Hell.
@LERI= Murali/Marie (nightmares (was:Re: ...it finally happened))

dwayne:
>But how would you manipulate an infinitely small space which contains
>all matter?

with caution.
@LERI= "free agent .rez" (dwayne says [he's done with sergio..]

Zeek wrote this on a fish:
: Suggestions?

Go for a walk in a park and _watch_ flowers and birds and little kids at
play. Take your mind of it. Listen to some really nice music. Eat some
icecream.
@LERI= Dwayne (Re: ...it finally happened)

When neurosis motivates an artist, the result is an art which solves the
artist's internal puzzle's. We are transfixed by this, because we are a
neurotic culture.
@LERI= silverado (Re: Interzone (more))

[...] The self IS the center of everything. We are subjective by nature, and
can only try to imitate objectivity. What is often considered schizophrenia
can just be a different level of consciousness where the illusion of
objectivity is removed entirely. Of course, this makes things that can be
dismissed by logic undeniably real.
@LERI= Robert Luscombe (Re: alien and their toys (fwd))

Rumor has it, of course, that an unfinished sentence really tends to
@LERI= Scotto

Seriously: what if they hypnotised you into thinking you were a clam ?
Would you drown?
@LERI= Dwayne (Re: hypnosis)

rez:
>first, any european lerilanders, be sure to Watch The Skies tonight for the
>meteor shower. us stateside fools won't get a good view, and i expect a
>Full Report. it's supposed to be a huge one, yeha.

X LOCATION: Britain, England, Bedfordshire, Luton, My house.

Y LOCATION: Second storey bedroom, between ground and thick bank of cloud.

ACTIVITY: Watching thick wall of black cloud completely covering all sky.

CONCLUSION: Squinting at clouds in the pitch black can be of limited interest.

OBSERVATIONS: I have a hunch the meteors were tha other side of tha cloud.
@LERI= SOL (euro meteor showers)

daveH shares the joke:
>"What's Bono doing here ? He's not dead yet!" And St. Peter
>says, "Oh, that's just God. He likes to think he's Bono."

ha, yeah; and i first heard this one back during those old desert-clad
Joshua Tree days... hehe, laughed then too. i tellya, this whole world thing
just keeps getting hilariouser and hilariouser... :P :)
@LERI= "free agent .rez" (he ha)

i feel like i have a lot to say. i feel like there is something burning
slowly in me, clearly, something i can, want to, and should articulate, and
every time it wells, i feel i must write to leri to Get It Out, but its very
elusive. I think its pudding, you know, ... the kind of pudding one finds
proof in. Maybe someone would call it fifth circuit and just be done with
it, but i wouldn't know anything about that, being mostly ignorant.
@LERI= juxlus

Culture is like the Watts Towers, a work of art made out of garbage.
@LERI= Daniel A. Foss (hallucinating western civilization)

[...] There are boysterous black men walking down my street all the time
every day. I happen to live in a ``multi-ethnic'' neighborhood. It's not
100% blacks. There's blacks and hispanics and orientals, and yeah, even some
whites. It's a rough neighborhood. Perhaps not like the west side of
Chicago, but people do get shot or stabbed on the street every now and then.
There are drug dealers around if you look for them. Yeah, I was attacked in
the alley behind my apartment late one night (my fault, but that's another
story). When I walk down the street, I have to be aware of what's going on
around me... the two guys hanging out on the sidewalk ahead of me, the
people stumbling out of the bar across the street, etc. In this environment,
I *am* a target: I'm clearly a lot more affluent than the people around me.
If I wanted to, I could leave, and move out to the (gasp) suburbs. But you
know what? I don't want to. I'm not really afraid. They're just people, like
you and me. That's the hardest thing to understand. It's easy to be afraid
of something that's different than you are, particularly when the media
encourages it.
@LERI= DaveH (Re: L.A. Media (was:Austin (kkk)))

I know a couple of psych nurses who are pagans, and they are _shit-scared_
that they will be found out and locked up. As one of my friends said to me
one night "it is very easy to get in, and virtualy impossible to get out".
Terrifying thought.
@LERI= Dwayne (Re: insanity)

Anarchists are quick to point out that one of the primary reasons the
U.S.S.R. developed into the totalitarian nightmare it is (or was) is because
the Bolsheviks assumed they could use The State as a means to implement
socialism... but the transition to a commmunism never did occur.

Instead, new figures rose up to replace the tyrants of old, themselves
becoming members of the new 'bourgeois.' 'The Communist Party' was anything
BUT communist -- rather, they were corrupt, power-hungry and obsessed with
personal gain, serving nobody other than themselves (much like the
politicians that infest OUR OWN CAPITOL today, eh? ;-)

Hell, I never really gave much credence to the ideals of socialism... until
I started living on my own and became an 'oppressed worker' myself. =)
@LERI= Christopher (Why I've Lost Faith In The Libertarian Party)

This morning around 2-3am. Standing in the middle of the soccer field,
tripping my balls off. Campus Security pulls up in their little truck,
motions me to walk over to the vehicle.

"What are you doing out this late?"

"Just watching the stars, officer. Got a problem with that?"

"No problem. Carry on."

Security drives off. I look up at the sky... DARK. GREY. AND COMPLETELY
OVERCAST. Not a STAR in the sky. (damn did I feel embarassed!) I guess the
officer had the notion that SOMETHING was up, other than astronomy class...
=)
@LERI= Christopher (Amusing Post-Trip Anecdote)

[...] the only difference between humans and rocks (or any other part of the
living universe) was that, in our special case here, Humans Speak English.
That's it. We have nervous systems, etc., true enough, but Consciousness
seems to be everywhere.
@LERI= Richard Ginn (Re: Question about Promethus Rising Stuff)

Cyber-evangelism! Be the first one on your
block to get the new electronic Jesus!

(Oh-oh, now when I die I'm sure to go to /dev/null)
@FC= Don Eliason (Re: the other side of the net)

Zeek writes:
> Please forward this announcement to appropriate mailing
> lists, newsgroups, bbs, and individuals.
> Sincere apologies to those who have seen this announcement too many times.

Wouldn't it be great if every identifiable piece of information already knew
whether you'd read it or not?
@FC= Evan Kirchhoff (Re: Cryptography Conference (Austin, Tx))

Arthur Chandler:
>
>   Domain Name: HEAVEN.COM
>
>   Administrative Contact:
>      Yapkowitz, Ken  (KY4)  ken@HEAVEN.COM
>      (818) 955-9999

welp, there it is... 2000 years of modern society wrestling with this issue,
we've all been praying to this "God" person/thing, when we should've been
sending our prayers to Ken Yapkowitz.

i dunno, Holy Father, Jah, they all sound better on the ear then Ken
Yapkowitz.

well, so, now do we wait and see where we go after death or do we just send
a quick e-mail off to Ken for the answers?
@FC= andy hawks (Re: The Younger Side of the NET)

Phillip Anzalone writes:
>I was just imagining. In the future, it is possible that there
>would be total immersion VR that rivals real life as far as
>resolution, sound, etc. If this were the case, people might have
>to run some sort of routine to remind them that they are in VR
>and not real life, such as a small blinking red light or a clock
>or something that floats in a certian "place" in their field of
>view.

How do you know that that big yellow ball glowing in the sky isn't a VR
reminder and we just forgot its purpose?
@ACP= Javier Garcia-Torres (Re: CyberFetish......)

Cyberpunk (to me) is about the interface of people and technology; of flesh
and electrode, brain and microchip. It is the humanizing of dehumanizing
technologies through the blend of man & machine.
@ACP= Lupo the Butcher (Luddite Cyberpunks? [was Re: Nowhere Generation])

David Sollors writes:
>Watch out, these folks are reading all newsgroups and are taking names,
>e-mail addresses, and locations of all of us as we speak. I wouldn't be
>surprised if the young Morris took the rap for a botched attempt by daddy
>and his Tri-lateral, illuminatus buddies to map out everything and place
>their slimy tentacles into *your* computer.

Hi!! I'd like to be placed on the NSA's mailing list. My e-mail address is
written below:
[...]
@ACP= Hyunsuk Seung (Re: Cuckoo's Egg...)

Hallucinogens, psychedelics and whatever else are instruments far too crude
to "edit the software" of the brain. They may skew the I/O and/or fuck up
the processing, but I wouldn't call this an enhancement.

I agree the brain is a chemical computer, but I don't think anyone has the
knowledge and skill, let alone the interface, to start writing microcode.
@ACP= mdc@cse (Re: CYBERPUNK FOOD)

> SO WHAT IS YOUR POINT AND HOW DOES IT PERTAIN TO EVERYONE ON the list?

this morning i woke up with a warm fuzzy hash'n'speed head, now i'm drinking
a cup of green tea... i like leri because it's a place where people can
share what the fuck they like with each other... for me, a post doesn't need
to be relevant (whatever that means) or to have a point to be dug... no
point means it's free, gratuitous, given... noise to you, signal to me...
'personal memo garbage'... my kinda trash!
@LERI= Al. (Re: The wonders of college life :-))

Idealistically, knowing or appreciating someone from the inside out ought to
be more important than being purely attracted to someone physically. The net
reinforces this ideal by eliminating the immediate sensual reactions,
leaving only the mind for people to react to.
@FC= Vicky (Re: life & the net)

change is not progress. they are not intertwined, they are completely
seperate concepts that may or may not be related at any given time.
@FC= andy hawks (the future and abortion)

the same comparisons Your Name Here made about beats<->cpunks could be made
about hippies<->cyberpunks.

hippies were anti-authoritarian, cyberpunks are. hippies didn't trust
anyone over 30, cyberpunks in the same stupid vain trust only themselves.
hippies had problems with the government, cyberpunks have problems with
gov't, military industrial complex, post-industrial business/zaibatsus...

hippies were into exploring the self through drugs, meditation, whatever,
cyberpunks are into [escaping/bettering] the self through drugs,
Stelarc-enhancements, etc...

hippies wore uniforms and were supposedly non-conformist, cyberpunks wear
uniforms and are supposedly non-conformist...

the people haven't changed, only the year on the calendar.
@FC= andy hawks (parallel bowel movements)

The net exists. Just because it is virtual doesn't mean it isn't real.
@FC= Dwayne (Re: my first day "teaching")

I wasn't around for your original question, but I offer my explanation in an
attempt to confuse things further.
@LERI= silverado (Re: meme alert (but what is a meme?))

The point where humans stepped out of the strictly animal world was the
creation of language and our ability to think in symbols.
@LERI= silverado (Re: meme alert (but what is a meme?))

It can be difficult to undo what has been done, but the first step is to
acknowledge it, recognise it, incorporate it, integrate it into our self and
then remake it in a form we find more pleasing.
@LERI= Gerold Firl (Re: retreat)

I think that the Internet expands to fit the noise uploaded.
@FC= John Frost (The mass-consumption of the net)

I'm told that the Chinese have a saying... Leadership is finding a parade
and getting in front of it. The Catholic Church has been dragging a parade
of ignorance behind it for centuries; this is not leadership. This is
psychological oppression. It may take a few more decades but the Church's
days are numbered unless they get with it, i.e. change.
@FC= Linda Morse (Re: the future and abortion)

: >I for one quite like the idea. Jails just harden criminals further, and
: >with the cost of "penitentiarization" rising and the cost of cryotech
: >dropping,

Wouldn't freezing criminals harden them further, too?
@ACP= Ben Parrish (Re: Reforming criminals)

Once upon a time there was a clear distinction being made between those
drugs that opened the mind and those that closed it down. Apparently that
distinction has been destroyed over the years and it is time to start
shouting it from the housetops again. It would help if someone, somewhere
would start telling the truth about drugs and their effects and allow people
to get unbiased information about the matter as a matter of medical
necessity so that they can make informed choices.
@ACP= Tom Collins (Re: CP drug use?)

Perhaps we could trade CPU time as a unit of value, rather than someone
else's IOU notes ? Just a thought...
@FC= Richard Ginn (Re: Card programmers)

Nature does not have a set of rules that must be followed or we'll get a
ticket from gaia.
@FC= Nick McDowell (Re: the future and abortion)

there's no need to say 'fuck the system' when the system was fucked from the
start... but i still think the best way to move pHorward is by inspiring
people to change, rather than through violent confrontation... but in the
end, it is sometimes necessary...
@LERI= Albert (Re: police and the system)

Sameer:
>Unsane:
>>
>> damn.
>>
>> what's the word for cutting off a man's penis?
>>
>       Castration.

no, that's the word for cutting off the testicles, where the little spermies
swim... (and they swam and they swam all over the dam)...

i think the word is "pain"... maybe "death" if you need a strong example in
your writing...;)

i'm starting to worry about you kyra... <half-smilie, i guess>
@LERI= andy hawks (Re: i fergot)

I just sent a message around the world to respond to someone down the block!
Funny thing this global villiage.
@FC= Nick McDowell (Re: the future and abortion)

for half the people to be doing fine, seems like the other half will have to
be sufferring. well, not like that's a Law of the Universe or whatnot, it's
just that i don't see how everyone could be feeling swell all the time.
unless everyone were simply spending all their time having sex, and
eventually someone would have to go to the kitchen to get a glass of water,
and then that person would miss out, and boom, we're back to square one.
@LERI= .rez (unified consciousness-field theory)

--
/  "Deitaram-se. Blimunda era virgem. Que idade tens, perguntou Baltasar, e \
] Blimunda respondeu, Dezanove anos, mas ja' enta~o se tornara muito mais    ]
] velha." - Jose' Saramago, "Memorial do Convento" .-------------------------]
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